Why Music and Ministry Matters in Our Family Business (and How We Do It) | S4 E10

Intro to Szn 4 Ep 10

SPEAKER_01 0:09

Well, hello, and welcome to another edition of the Family Business Podcast with the Alessies, where we get into some really good topics here, some topics we cannot get into on Sunday. We don't have time on Sunday, and uh maybe just we like to stretch out the conversation a little bit longer. And I'm here today with our oldest daughter, Stephanie. Hello, Muina.

SPEAKER_02 0:31

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

She is a new mom and a new wife, and she is living the life. And we wanted to talk to you guys today about our experience working together. She and I, mother and daughter. Yes, we do. We figure it out. We are, we have figured it out. We are figuring it out as we go. Yes. But what we want our audience to know today is kind of the conversations that we have in the office. We've had them recently because we've been putting out so new music together. And so even some of the other staff that have heard us talking have suggested you need to make a podcast out of that because that would really be helpful to people. So we said, let's do it. So what are we going to talk about today, Steph?

SPEAKER_02 1:09

Sure. So I wanted to kind of expand on the conversations you and I have about not just songwriting and music making, because that's so easy. But the next step when you have a really great album and you want to know how to put it out there, how do you rely on Nashville and the world out in Nashville and music labels and contracts and managers and tours? How do you how do you manage that? How do you utilize that? But also keep your number one job, which is leading worship every single Sunday and working with your family or working with your uh team back at home. How do you balance that? And you and I have had so many conversations about how people in Nashville are so amazing and they're you can, they're actually very useful, but also they can sort of take the fire out of you. Yeah. Because it makes you think about the business side of it all. And then sometimes being at home and leading a really great worship set on a Sunday morning gives you so much more excitement than a record deal. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:16

And

Our Roles - Worship Services Vs. Recording Industry

SPEAKER_01 2:17

let's let's let's talk about that. Let's define that because we do, we kind of have two roles that that uh meld into one big role. So we have the worship on Sunday, where you lead worship, you have two teams that you have to oversee along with Alan Paul, who's also our podcast manager and uh our MD. He's an amazing musician. He's one of the best. Um the best. Let's just say the best. The best. The best. Amen. Amen. And uh no, he's really talented. So the two of you together oversee it. I oversee the whole ministry. But um, you guys really deal with the day-to-day working with volunteers, creating the set list, making sure everybody shows up at both campuses, knows the songs, rehearses the songs, sings them correctly, the whole thing. It's a lot. Then on the side, we write, create songs that we release. Our church sings. Yep. But it really we start with kind of the mindset of we're gonna do this for our church. Yeah. We're gonna write these songs for our church, we're gonna sing these songs for our church. And then what do we do then? And that's where it gets super hard. Because singing them for the church, we get instant gratification. We they love them, but then how do you package that and how do you get it out? And that's where you and I, over the last couple of years, we've constantly like morphed it. We have. And it's been a lot of work finding the right people to work with. And we just want people out there to know it is a lot harder than than it looks.

SPEAKER_02 3:40

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 3:40

Yes. It is a lot harder, and there's a lot of sacrifices you have to make. Um, there's finances involved, there's investment of time and money.

SPEAKER_02 3:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:48

And you really, you've got to make sure you're writing good songs.

SPEAKER_02 3:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:52

And that people love and like before you put this big investment in it. But the other part that you and I have kind of walked through over the last couple of years, going in even, you know, into COVID with a contract with a label that you had individually, and we weren't sure would we bring the church into that? Do we not? And we've just moved really, really slow. Yeah. Um, and one thing that we learned is, and you can expound on this, don't put all your eggs in one basket. In one basket.

SPEAKER_02 4:21

Yes. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 4:22

So what have we learned in that regard for us personally?

SPEAKER_02 4:25

Yeah, I think that you're you said it perfectly. You have two different worlds. We have I you have the Nashville world and you have the Sunday morning church world. Yeah. And you sometimes you write two different songs for both, you write a song for both uh worlds or two different songs for each world. Yeah. And um, meaning your heart's in one and your hearts in not sometimes. And I, for a little while, I can be a little bit more intense and about my like how if I have a goal in mind, I'm gonna be very intense about that goal, which is great. But also when you need balance to complete something, or you need um, you need to have if you need to spread out your eggs in all of your different basket baskets, you need to kind of reel back that intensity. Because for a little while, I believed that it was smart to just completely ditch the Nashville world. Right. Who cares? Do what the bet the way you should do it. Just follow your calling, follow the doors that are open, and just stick to your home and it'll come your way. Nashville will come back around. Just wait. But why did you feel that way? Because because of what you were experiencing, because of what I was experiencing, and there really wasn't much going on in Nashville, and I got a little impatient. And I was a I was waiting for the doors to open, and they weren't entirely open the way I wanted them to be.

SPEAKER_03 5:50

Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

And you did have a door open, a good door, but it's like the Nashville world is the Nashville world. Everything is very slow, yes, and they're all attracted to whatever the newest candies out there, and and labels change over. They people change, they circulate. The staff you get to know that you're working with that's helping you get your song out, they're gone, they've gone on to a new label. So it's very disillusioning because you just get traction and you have these meetings with people in Nashville and they make these promises, and then you get the call. Oh, we're so sorry, I hate to tell you stuff, but we're going to this other label. Yeah. So you start over. It's like every year you're starting over with somebody new.

SPEAKER_02 6:25

And I'm my mistake was thinking that that was a slam door in my face.

SPEAKER_01 6:28

You thought it was personal.

SPEAKER_02 6:29

I thought it was personal. And I thought that that was God's no. Right. When it's not, it's not true. It's just the industry. That's how it is. And time's on your side in the music industry. Yeah. With music, time's on your side. Like your name was put in the bath in the in the hat. Right. Sometimes, yeah, your name's not picked out for 10 years, but it's there. People know you. That's right. And that's okay. That is actually a win in the music world. Some people are still dying to meet people in the music industry, and there's there's just writing songs, not having any idea what to do with them. But back to your comment about having your eggs in one basket. It's true. You don't want to be so intense about, I have this song and I'm just going to use it for this one little project. I'm just going to use it for the church, or I'm only going to use it for this one label. It is really okay to let a song be used in multiple fields where I wrote wouldn't change a thing. And I, I for a little while had the blinders on and thought, oh, that's just a music industry song. Another song is Innocent, where I'm like, oh no, I only wrote it with people in Nashville. I can't take it anywhere else. But then our Easter special came up and we thought, hey, let's just use it for that. And for a minute I got nervous, like, no, there's writers on it. What is the royalties? And your fear just kind of comes in because of the unknown of the industry. When really it's better to ask for forgiveness than permission sometimes. And just jump in and use your creativity in multiple realms and multiple fields. And let time take play its course. Like, don't get so adamant about um, okay, well, nothing's really come up with our songwriting at church. Then why? Some that must mean that God's not in it, or I haven't gotten any request from Nashville. I haven't gotten any, nobody's pursuing me about this music industry thing. But that's kind of okay. Let time pass and time is in let a year pass. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:30

Let two years pass. It's your it's in your favor because you're developing and growing and getting more confident. And you might even write a better song in the process. Yes. You know, the thing going back to what you said about the songs that are the industry, can we sing them? That has been an issue because you signed with a label. You're you're uh independent now. You're actually with Miami Life Sounds, our church.

SPEAKER_02 8:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:52

But um they they we keep them on the hook. We keep that label on the hook. We also have somebody that helps us um monthly help us get our songs out there on Spotify and Apple iTunes, and that's an investment, but it's a blessing because we're building our team. So as time goes by, what's wonderful is we get to really work and um create this ministry team that's ours. And yeah, sorry, keep going. Well, I this is what I wanted to say about the songs you mentioned that oh, are they industry or are they for the church? It's so easy to get stuck, but the truth is it's like, and here's an analogy. Horses, if you own horses, they tell you horses either need to be walked or they need to be read. And if you don't ride them or walk them, there's no sense in having a horse. But you you can't just leave them, you have to ride them. Use them horses. I mean, songs are the same way. Horses are the same way. Horses with you, sing your horse. No, horses are the songs. I need one more cup of coffee. Um, songs are the same way. You gotta sing them. Yeah. So you don't want to shelve it and wait because you're hoping and crossing your fingers that somebody's gonna pick it up. Sing the song if you have the opportunity. Yeah, and that's what you have done, even bringing back some of our old songs, some of my old songs to the church. Yeah, because those songs need to be sung. And in that process of just doing what we're supposed to do, this world is created for us. Opportunities open up, and we're not frustrated sitting around waiting, waiting, waiting for somebody to make our dreams come true.

SPEAKER_02 10:25

Yes. And you know, there is a proverb that I read um that spoke on diligence, and I can't think of it exactly, so I'm gonna butcher it. But it pretty much says the diligent person will always be successful. Yeah. And it doesn't say the most creative one. No, it doesn't say the best song will the most talented one. It just says the diligent one. And that's the truth. And it's true. Just stay diligent with your songwriting, stay diligent with your creativity. Put it on the calendar every week. I'm gonna get on my piano, I'm gonna get on my guitar, I'm gonna finish the song, I'm gonna gather the songwriters around. We've been doing that with some of our songwriters here at the church where they're just your average everyday singers, and none of us really are the best songwriters, but we get together and we write songs because we want to make it clear that we are pursuing songs for our church and for our house. But I wanted to ask you a question. Okay. Um when it comes to the music industry, there's two approaches that I've learned you can make to the industry. There's the business mindset, cutthroat. I'm just here to get what I need and get my name out there, get my name out there. Yes, I care about you. I think you're a great person, but really you're just a coworker to me. You're not really somebody I can do relationships with. But then there's the relational mindset where I'm gonna let's go out to coffee, let's go out to dinners. Even if you go from label to label to label, we're gonna keep that relationship. But I may get run over by the businessmen in that world. Which mindset would you say

The Importance of Relationships in Business

SPEAKER_02 12:05

is better for the long haul?

SPEAKER_01 12:07

Um, I think the right mindset, and I want to make sure I have clarity on exactly what you're asking me. One is more business, one is more relational. Yeah. It definitely is you will go farther and last longer in the in the whole thing, having a relational mindset. And I'll give you an example. Um when we needed to, we just re just recorded a Christmas project and we wanted to get the music out there. We knew that it's good for radio. Not everything's good for radio because it's very expensive, and we don't that radio is bought and paid for by some of the biggest artists out there, so you you can't. But with Christmas music, they get real desperate.

SPEAKER_02 12:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:50

So radio will be more prone to play your stuff. But it is still very pricey just to shop one project, just to shop it, a song. It might not even make it, but you've still got to pay your radio rep to get the songs to the stations. So we were able to reach back almost 15 years ago to somebody we were in relationship with that was still in the business, call them up. First thing she said was, How's Pastor Steve? How are y'all doing? That's crazy. And because we built that relationship, we didn't burn a bridge. Yeah, we kept her as a friend all these years. She's like, send it to me, let me see what I can do. Um so I think for like for anything, your life, whether it's business or whether it's personal, is what you build it to be and what you make it to be, and the right people that you surround yourself with.

SPEAKER_03 13:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 13:39

And so if it's all because this is what's happening too, even in the Christian music world today, and I'm just gonna say it in the worship world. Relationship is not valued. No. It's writing these songs fast and furiously, collaboration, social media, and and hey, and we making your socials look good. And we've we've seen it recently where what we thought was this incredible ministry of these collabs, which is an industry term for this guy that was a worship leader, and this guy was and this girl, and they're all getting together writing these incredible songs with these song, this church worship team. Oh my gosh, and now they're millions of views and they're traveling, and then all of a sudden they're turning on each other socially on social media publicly because one's not walking the walk. Yeah. Okay. So relationally, forget that that's what what kind of an example is that to the church and to the world? Because they did get the world's attention. Yeah. That we eat our own. Yeah. So when they're not relational first, yeah, that our relationship is what brings this blessing. Yeah. And the truth is, it goes back to the word of God. It's when we agree, when we are united, there is the blessing. That is where the anointing comes through your unity. And I don't want a life that's not blessed in every area of my life. Yeah, a good example is the Binions.

SPEAKER_02 15:00

There you go. Their longevity is unsurpassed because of the relationship that they've sewn into those labels. And I think And pastors. And pastors in churches. You're right. Exactly right. They stuck to just living an integrous life.

SPEAKER_03 15:16

They did.

SPEAKER_02 15:16

And um, I think that really it's not either or, because what I've seen with the David and Nicole and with you and with Aunt Martha is it's not relationship or business. It's relationship so you can do business. That's right. It's a, hey, we're in relationship. Can you help me get the song out there? Right. We you and I have been, we've been in this game for five, ten years. Can you get me connected with this person? That's right. And it's not opportunistic because there's a fine line, because that means you want to do business so you then create the relationship. But I'm gonna first prioritize my relationship. I'm gonna call you and ask you how your family's doing. I'm gonna pray for your family. Um and more, and if no business comes out of it, I'm happy because we did relationship. But it allows you, it allows the op the door to open for business. That's right. And I would say when it comes to being a creative and when it comes to being a songwriter, you've got to reach this moment of contentment where you do you will be completely fine writing songs for your church, putting out albums for your church with just a few hundred thousand or just a few thousand streams, but you kept your family, that's right. You kept your integrity, and you wrote songs that you loved to people that you love. You got to reach that point of contentment.

SPEAKER_01 16:39

And FOMO is real in this, in what we do, because you have this fear of missing out. I'm here, I'm serving, uh, they're not singing, they're not excited about the song. And there's this big world out there where people would adore me and crowds would come. And and the truth is, you don't know that that's true, and that might not even be God for you specifically. Yeah. But I don't, I just don't even think that is a good way. I don't think it's a healthy way to think because you need to love where you are.

SPEAKER_03 17:07

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 17:08

You need to love where you are. We say it this way because the Bible says it, you will bloom where you're planted. Yeah. And if your feet are one place and your head is another, and your fantasy land is in another thing, you won't be blessed where you are because you're not fully invested where you are.

SPEAKER_03 17:22

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 17:23

And that's one thing we have learned over the years of even um having other worship leaders that would come in and either want to write with us or sing with us. We we've always been very guarded about people who have the same mindset about worship. Because the truth of the matter is whatever we do with our music and however far it goes or doesn't go is not on us. Yeah. That is God's job. We love what we do here in Miami with our teams. That's where our heart is. Yeah. And if we never recorded another song, it wouldn't affect what we do.

SPEAKER_02 17:56

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 17:57

It wouldn't affect loving what we do. Yeah. Because we've looked, we set, we set back and we've said, okay, money has to be invested in here for us to go farther.

SPEAKER_02 18:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:08

Take it out of the Sunday environment and to to the radio, to social media, to the bigger audiences. Okay, money has to be invested. Is this a good investment? Yeah. Is it a good investment to put however much money in it? And to have some dreamy ideals that you just are because you say you are, is wrong. It's wrong. And it's a wrong expectation of your pastor or the people in your life. It's it's not right.

SPEAKER_02 18:33

I think that's a great point to bring up that if you are a young person in youth group or young adult and you

The Challenges of Creating With Others

SPEAKER_02 18:41

want to help raise up a songwriting community in your church, you the creativity will come easy. You need to get some music business lessons, you need to get money business lessons. You do. You need to figure out music law and how that works out. That's right. I would say if you want to gain the trust of your pastor to oversee a group like that, get the logistics down. Look at the money, look at the legal, the legalism or the legalistics of it all. Yes. And look at royalties, look at payouts, learn about all of the business side yourself. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 19:15

Yourself. While you're waiting for your song to be a hit, figure out how it works where you don't get in trouble with the IRS, where you don't get in trouble with other writers that you pay them.

SPEAKER_02 19:24

How do I put if I wrote this song with somebody in our church and they're not on staff at our church? That's right. How do we? That's a thing. What if my what if our song's the way the next Waymaker? And we don't know. You don't know. And you want to put everybody's names on it, but your pastor's telling you, maybe be careful whose name you put on that on that song. That's right. That is a real conversation.

SPEAKER_01 19:43

Figure that all out, and then the creativity will come. Well, nobody cares about the song. We all just want to be in the room until it's a hit.

SPEAKER_02 19:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:52

And then we start counting pennies. Wait a minute, I was there. My song's on it. And of course it happens. Yeah. I I can tell you from relationships that I've had to have longevity in the industry. Um, there have been rooms I was in that I could have easily called and said, listen, I contributed a line. I contributed. But if my name didn't get on there, I just let it go. Meet you. Because it's just not worth hurting a friendship and a relationship that could lead to another opportunity because I wanted an eighth of a cut of a song. That's so true. I mean, I just I'm not gonna do that. I know. I am not going to do that.

SPEAKER_02 20:29

And on the other side, if you were the leader in that room and somebody was in that room and they literally contributed one word, right, just get put their name on there.

SPEAKER_01 20:39

Well, be generous. I have to tell you a story from years ago. We were, I was working with Aaron Lindsay and we were writing um one of those songs that I wrote. Uh anyway, my brain's not working today. But anyway, there was a song we needed that need that needed to say da-da-ding. It needed three syllables and end ing. And we were struggling and struggling. We couldn't think of it. So we're just racking our brains. And the janitor was in the sanctuary while we're there, and he's he's he's vacuuming. And all the and he hears us like for 30 minutes because he's cleaning and he's vacuuming and he's picking up paper. And all of a sudden he yells out, uh, excuse me, offer ring. And we were like, Does he get credit for that? Does he get credit for that? And so I yelled out. I went, you don't get credit for that. That's a but you know, that's an example of what some people will do. Yeah. I gave you a word. Yeah. Therefore, and and that's not, don't do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Give it away. Give it away, give it away. And God will bless you more than you could ever imagine. And that's where it becomes business over relationship. Yeah. And those are the things that you have to determine what do you value. So for us, what we value the most is the relationship we have with God and with our church, and with our staff and with our Our team here and Miami Life Sounds that's owned by our church. Yeah. So because we value that the most, yeah, not Nashville, not the potential of the future, not social media buzz. We value mostly the church that bore us. Yeah. And that is our is the reason that we're even able to do what we're able to do. So we we value that relationship, but all else pales and bows to that relationship. Yes. That comes first. And we we say no to things, we don't mistreat the relationship with our church. We don't ask for more than we deserve. Don't forsake either one. Yeah. And we see that God has and is blessing this other side. Yes. But we're, as you've been saying a whole lot lately, what even pursuing the business has done for you is make you love what I have here more. What you have here even more.

SPEAKER_02 22:54

Oh, totally. Because this is it's lifelong. It's actually going to make my life and not it's it's meaningful. It's actual ministry. Yeah. It's actual ministry. And I think you need both. You need your CCM artists, you need your people that like a Phil Wickham and for King and Country. You need those people to go on tours and they are great on the radio. I think if that's a door that's been opened to you, pursue it, go for it, like a Lauren Daigle. Right. And if you want to be something like that, sure. But I know that there the fruit of roots is something you can't just get in the last

The Fruits of Developing Roots in Ministry

SPEAKER_02 23:35

half of your life. No. And I don't want to forsake that. I've seen that in y'all's life. I've seen that in some of our staff members' lives. And I don't want to give that up. And I love writing songs. I think that singing it at different churches would be so much fun one day. But for the sake of my roots, nah, I don't think it's worth it. I don't think it's worth it. And honestly, I have found more satisfaction in the single mom or the older man or the young youth kids that love the song. I have found more satisfaction in them coming to me after service saying that they needed that song than a really great email from somebody in Nashville.

SPEAKER_01 24:20

100%. You know, that isn't opportunistic and doesn't necessarily follow through and can be gone tomorrow at another label.

SPEAKER_02 24:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 24:28

And you said something about roots. I think this is so important because I'm, let's see, how old are you? 25? 26. 26, and I'm 38. Let's see. No. Um yeah, so I'm a lot older than you. But in every decade, you build a really strong root system that helps you sustain that harvest in the future. And whether it is writing for 10 years, just staying focused on writing the songs in those 10 years, developing your knowledge of the business and the industry and how that works, getting your feet wet, building relationships with people that believe in you, that might be able to say, financially, we can invest in you to make this happen. Do that. Spend that time developing that root supply. That is so, so important. And not think, oh, I've wasted time because I'm not here already. You didn't waste, you're building, you're going deep, you're learning so that what happens with people that don't have a good root system is they literally spin out of control if they do get involved in the business side of things and in the industry, because it is just filled with people that don't necessarily have your best interest at heart.

SPEAKER_02 25:37

And mom, in the 30 years you've been in the music industry, yes, maybe the outside aspects have changed, but the core of the music industry, do you think it has changed? Nothing. Nothing's changed.

SPEAKER_01 25:50

Yeah. People are people. Yeah. We've changed the system a little bit to make money here, make money there, use social media. But at the core of it, it is dog eat dog. Yeah. It's everybody's trying to make a way for themselves, get to the top, using the system to do it. They all will try to say, especially in the Christian industry, oh, we're going to do it differently. We're all going to be about relationship. It's like politics. Yeah. And at the end of the day, if you're going to be in it, it's political. Yeah. You don't really get to do it that way unless you're going to not look like the industry at all.

SPEAKER_02 26:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:21

So you have to know what that world consists of, and even decide if it's for you. I and I want to say this because we're worship leaders and we love our church and we love leading worship primarily. So we're not going to get suckered in a room when a label pitches something to us that is pipe dreams and empty promises. Yeah. Because we've been down that road. We know that at the end of the day, you said it in Proverbs, it's the diligent.

SPEAKER_03 26:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:47

We still have to do the hard work. We've still got to write the songs. We've still got to make sure we know the royalty splits. We've still got to make sure that we know how to get it up on Spotify and Apple Music and Tune Core and learn. We don't get to skip the hard step and just fly away and make our songs fame. That's ridiculous. And we could still be very, very productive and successful. And you, and the majority of the world never knows our name.

SPEAKER_02 27:15

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 27:15

But yet we are still successful. And we have to define what that success is. But I just want to say this about people that call themselves worship leaders. I remember a few years ago, there was a person that I sat with and they made this statement. Now they're worship leaders, they they go to churches and sing and they'll be on staff for a little bit here, a little bit there. And they said, you know, I'm not really a worship leader. My heart is to be in the industry and to be an artist. And honestly, at this season of my life, I was sitting in that room and I had to just walk away because it, I mean, the the the I just got mad. Okay. I don't want to say the word rage. That's an extreme word. But I I got so irritated. But I did say, well, then why are you singing for churches?

SPEAKER_02 28:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:00

Go do that. If that's what you're gonna go do, move over there, go do that. Yeah. And don't leech off the church. Say that. Don't leech off the body of Christ so that you can develop your gift to be an artist. Artist?

SPEAKER_02 28:15

Yeah. No.

SPEAKER_01 28:16

Get out of here. Yeah. I'm sorry. I have zero, as you can tell, tolerance for that. Because let the worshipers arise.

SPEAKER_02 28:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:23

We are a Levitical priesthood. We are worship leaders first. Exactly. We're not trying to stir up some artist in us. Yeah. That's not who we are or ever will be. And anybody that wants to go do that, go do that. Do yourself a favor, go do that. Yeah. Because the truth is, the audiences here in the churches, our church audiences, they could smell that a mile away. Yeah. They know when you're performing. Yep. And so that's the thing. If you're a performer and you want performance royalties and you want to be an artist, go do that.

SPEAKER_02 28:57

Stay out of the church. But the ones that want to worship and actually pastor through worship, get your roots down there deep and trust in God for whatever song comes your way.

SPEAKER_01 29:07

And let the process that's hard of building a team every Sunday morning, that's not picking up your guitar, putting it in your, you know, your guitar kit and putting it on a bus and having this dream of a bus. And what, you know, go live that dream if that's what you want to live. Yeah. But that's not Sunday morning church. That's not what we want to do or are called to do.

SPEAKER_02 29:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:29

The process of it being hard and it being about others is where we've written some of the best songs. I know. We sing. I know.

SPEAKER_02 29:38

And last thing, because I don't know if we're done with our timing, like three or four minutes. Awesome. So one thing that I remember when I would go to Nashville and I have to go do songwriting sessions is you know when a songwriter's entered the room, and you know when a pastor's entered the room.

SPEAKER_01 29:54

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 29:54

It is so true. It is so different because the eagerness to get the just get the song done, just get the song done, just get the song done. Which I respect because, yes, songwriters, I get it. Songwriters are great. You need your songwriters, you need them. But they're just there to get the song done, get the demo made, and turn it in. But then when a pastor enters the room, you have a nice long conversation. Sure. They show you around their church, they show you pictures of the people, they tell you about the girl that just got pregnant in their church and she's been struggling with infertility. They want to maybe open up with prayer. And honestly, the song is sometimes terrible at the end of the day. It's not even that good. Yeah. But the heart behind it, you just felt like you just walked into somebody who knew ministry that had seen a thing or two. Right. And they can handle a thing or two. Right. And it's really just to anybody listening to this, wondering which road that should they take, which road do you prefer? I prefer the pastors. I it roots are my thing. I love to be with people that actually do ministry. And if you want to go into songwriting, don't don't don't try to be both. Right. Don't try to leech off those pastors, like you said, so you can then better your songwriting. Go be with songwriters. Go to Nashville. Be in wherever you want to be.

SPEAKER_01 31:13

Friendships with those writers.

SPEAKER_02 31:14

Bill, yes, that's the perfect way to say it. Yes. But it is funny how you felt immediately the difference when they walked into the room.

SPEAKER_01 31:23

Somebody who really had ministry on their mind. And you, it's more than just writing a song. Yeah. That relationship is really what God is saying. Do you see this? This is an opportunity here for the long haul.

SPEAKER_03 31:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:37

Because the relationship to pursue it and to keep it and to develop it, it's going to have its ups and downs. But out of it is born something more beautiful that might not come for 10 more years. Yes. You know, I we go back to the Binions. We've been friends with them for many, many years, and they've traveled the world and they sing and their road ministry is big. And they've just started a church. So they're learning kind of in the opposite way where we started a church and then on the road. But one thing that you take from all that is you from if you're standing on the outside of our relationship with some of the people we've had for years that are in the industry, you can't be jealous of it. Yeah. Because we worked hard for it. Yeah. We didn't just work to write songs, get in, get out, and get our splits. It's managing, helping one another when a teenager's uh giving us an issue or or when financially we we're having a rough month. We've been there for each other for the long haul. We can the the music writing is secondary. We know now. Yes, we just did it. We got in the studio with David and in about six hours wrote two songs, awesome songs. Yes. That, and we had as much fun doing it. Yeah. So I know this might make some people's brains explode, what we're explaining. But the truth is, if you would embrace this, if people would embrace this truth, those who want to be in the Christian music world, build the friendships. Yeah. Love your church. Yeah. Write for your church. Learn the industry. Keep your rear end right where it is. Don't try to live where you are and take a pig check from your church and dream about being on a tour bus. Don't, no. God's not going to bless that. No. God will bless you because you're planted. Yes. Heart, spirit, soul, and body and mind. You are planted right where you are. And it's better to just do it.

SPEAKER_02 33:29

Just do it. Write the songs. Introduce them to your pastors. Ask if you can. If they say no, okay, wait a little bit. Trust God. Trust God. Then keep doing the worship leader work. Keep singing. Keep choosing the songs. But don't become so afraid of, well, who am I trying to become that you don't do anything? Right. Don't don't worry about the end goal. Right. Just start, write your songs, introduce them, do what you can now. That's the process. And let God let God unravel what He has for you. That's so good.

SPEAKER_01 33:58

You unravel me with a melody. Exactly. Well, you surround me with a song. How do we finish this? We finish it by saying that we really know that our future is not just set for it, it doesn't just excite us because of what we're going to be. We're excited about who we are right now. Exactly. We're excited about the songs God's given us right now. And we are, every song He gives us, we are carefully nurturing, presenting, and blessing people around us with it. And God is obligated to bless that. That's good. And He will.

SPEAKER_02 34:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:37

So that's it for us. We hope we've helped you. We hope it continues to help you. Share, please like, comment, and share this podcast. And Stephanie, it's been great. I love it, Mom, having you on. All right. God bless you guys.

SPEAKER_00 34:52

You've just enjoyed another episode of the Family Business Podcast with the Alesssies, and we can't thank you enough for being a part of our podience today. Now that you've learned more about us, here's how you can join in in the family business. First, make sure you're following our podcast right now and download this episode so you can hear it at any time. Second, think of someone you know that might need or enjoy this episode and share it with them. You'll be helping them and helping us to spread the word about the family business. Third, go to AlesiFamily Business.com and tap the Ask the Alessies button. This is really cool. You can use it to record a voicemail comment or question, and we can add your voice to our conversations. Finally, while you're on our page, tap the reviews tab and you'll see a link to leave a review on Apple Podcasts. We love reading your reviews and we might even share them on the show. Thanks again for joining us, and we'll see you next time at the Family Business with the Alesssies because family is everybody's business.